Band Politics Discussion Group?

[Plasmatopia]

My band has been going through some really ridiculous shenanigans over the past few years. Some of it is super annoying, some is just plain humorous...although telling those stories may not portray some individuals in the best light. Sometimes wish I had a place to vent to some people who would understand, have been through similar stuff, etc. I've always held back because anything posted here could potentially turn up in a Google search.

So I was wondering if there would be any interest in starting a Group to discuss this type of thing (hopefully I'm correct in assuming Group content is not going to turn up in an Internet search?). We could still use fake names or whatever to protect identities and facilitate more interesting, honest, and in-depth discussion. This would be partly for venting, but also a way of inviting suggestions for how to best deal with certain personalities. In other words, a safe place to bitch, but keeping in mind the overall intent is to make things better and NOT to smear anyone or spread bad ju-ju. Like therapy.

Any interest?

[rcarlberg]

It would have to be a private forum, password-protected and not open to web crawlers.

[Plasmatopia]

Wow, I'm blown away but the massive response here. Okay, I guess this was a bad idea. I think y'all would've found my stories amusing. And for the record I should've pointed out that I'm not looking for dirt from people who might be currently involved in some prog bands we all know or anything like that. I was thinking of stories from old cover bands we might have been involved in 20 years ago, etc.

[Jerjo]

Well, it's a holiday weekend and things are quiet on the web. Give it a few days.

[Plasmatopia]

Well, it's a holiday weekend and things are quiet on the web. Give it a few days.

Yes, that could be the case. We're not even good "Easter Catholics"...we haven't done anything at all to celebrate Easter this year, especially with no kids at home.

[3LockBox]

paging KerryKompost ;-)

[beano]

One time in Band camp...

[Rune Blackwings]

Paging anyone ever doing anything with Hawkwind or Kiss

[Vic2012]

I'd be interested in reading some of the stories right here on this thread. I think if you're worried that someone from your band reads this thread and gets offended then it's best to squash the whole idea. There's no privacy on the internet. On the other hand, one thing that really frustrates me is when someone opens up about some band conflict on a public thread, and then responds to questions by posters with "please respect my privacy, it's personal and I'd prefer not to discuss that" .....or similar words. Uh, okay?

[Garyhead]

Yes. Being in a band is like being in a 4 or 5-way marriage. There seems to be at least one squabble going on all the time. I've been in a band that made some VERY creative music yet couldn't get along with each other on a personal level.
We haven't worked together now for almost 8 years.....we do not even check in on each other anymore.....sad. 2 cd's completed and at least one other in the can and all for nought.
For me, there was nothing more exilirating than making music with creative passionate people. I miss that.

[Plasmatopia]

Most of the people in my band don't even know how to use the Internet...getting them to do a Google search where they would actually find this thread in this forum seems really unlikely.

[No Pride]

Yeah, so I'd say go ahead and tell your story. You can always change the names to protect the guilty.

I've been pretty lucky, been in close to 50 bands in my time (counting ones that only did one or two gigs before disbanding or only existed for a recording project) and have had very few personal conflicts. Musical conflicts (like three bandmates agreeing that a fourth one wasn't cutting it), yes, but very little in the way of out and out jerks. Flakes and slackers... well that's a different story.

Sometimes you just have to vent...

[Plasmatopia]

Well, I did need to vent, but the moment has somewhat passed, what with a busy last few days, coming down with a nasty cold, etc. We have a gig coming up this weekend, so I'm sure the passion to flog this situation in colorful terms will re-ignite very soon.

My band plays mostly '80s covers of Bon Jovi, Journey, etc., along with some '70s stuff like Boston, Foreigner, the occasional Lynyrd Skynyrd tune, etc. I can't say the name of the band, but it cracks me up that the name of the band is based on the number of people that were in the band. Personally I've always thought it was a stupid band name to begin with, being somewhat, um, suggestive and not in the most clever way. Now that we have more people in the band it really makes no sense. The guys who've been in the band longest have assigned legend to the name of mythical proportions -- the name cannot be changed because "we've worked long and hard to develop our reputation". I find that to be utterly absurd. I shudder to think what that rep might be. I see new bands popping up all the time around here, presumably consisting of the same old local musicians reconfigured and they are having no problem finding gigs. I think at the time of booking you can just say "three fifths of the band used to be in band xxx" and that should be fine if you really ever had the reputation you think you had. But I digress.

This all points to one overriding theme: one or two of the guys have some weird, overinflated view of themselves and the band. One in particular seems to control all booking (to our detriment), all the PA, and after several years I've recently discovered the mechanism by which he also controls all our song choices.

Our singer tried to book a gig near the area she lives. She's new to us in the last year or so and has been singing in bands for the last 20 years and has a TON of great contacts, a lot of which are from an area we've never played. Our keyboard player, whom we've not-so-affectionately nicknamed "Mittens", asked her if they had enough power for the band, saying "they've never seen a band like US before." I'm thinking "yeah, lucky for them", lol. This guy is all about having maximum PA wattage whether it's needed or not. I think he may be starting to see the light and he's starting to downsize. He downsized so much he's selling off a ton of microphones. He wants all the drums mic'ed, but he just sold off all the drum mics. "Well I told [the drummer] I'd give him a hell of a deal on the drum mics, but he didn't want to buy 'em." Sorry, but you just can't make somebody buy something. Our drummer is scraping by, and it's not like he was told upon joining the band he'd be responsible for supplying drum mics. Our drummer's argument is that he has never in all his years playing in various bands needed to mic his kit in his entire life - if the other guys want that it's their problem. This ended up in one of the most heated discussions the band has ever had a couple nights ago. They told him he needed to contact [a mutual friend] to borrow a kick mic. I was like, hey guys, I have a kick mic -- problem solved. Sheesh.

That seems like a minor thing, but it points to a bigger problem. It goes back to a couple months ago when the keyboard player got his nose out of joint about something (he never told us what) and decided to sell off a bunch of stuff. That stuff DOES belong to him, so obviously we have no say, but I still think he should have taken 5 minutes to sit the band down and say "here's what I'm doing, I hope you'll support this decision, here's what it means to the band" and get some buy-in. It's a matter of diplomacy. I guarantee it would have eliminated a significant amount of heartburn.

Mittens doesn't care though. Everything he does is passive-aggressive sabotage. Our singer called a local fair and negotiated $1000 gig. She then handed over the contact info to Mittens. It took 3 weeks before he followed up after he kept "losing" the contact info, etc. Somehow, when he got done, it was a $500 gig and he refused to play it because it was in a tent. WTF? And he has our guitar player convinced of his version of events. Our singer booked another place for her other band (she also has a band that does country stuff and sort of the country side of rock), she has known the guy who handles the booking for this place for years. She told Mittens that this place was booking up fast and asked if he had been in contact. "Oh yeah, so-and-so and I are working on some bigger, special projects this summer." So our singer asked the booking dude if he'd heard from Mittens. Nope.

It comes down to the fact that Mittens is threatened by our singer booking gigs. He'd rather sabotage them completely than let her have anything to do with the process. He can be a really nice guy, can be quite generous, and I can get along with him okay, but I'm tired of all the ridiculous over-the-top stupid comments he makes. He constantly says things that I know are untrue, but I just zip my lip for the sake of harmony -- I don't think he'd like me very much if I called him out on every one of his BS statements (usually something he pulls out of his arse in an effort to make himself look like some wizened old musician).

The other night after practice he called up our drummer and asked him to be in another band he's starting. He'll probably never start this other band (he asked me the same question 2 years ago). I'm not comfortable with him having so much control when he is actually holding us back and potentially more interested in putting another band together to play the same music simply because he sees his control beginning to slip. He's probably not too happy about the Rush medley the drummer and I proposed the other night, lol.

Well, that's more than enough of a rant for now. There's so much more I could write. I wish I could remember all the stupid things that have been said and done over the last 4 years with these guys. They live in a bubble (the drummer and I call it "the egg") where only they (the keyboard player and guitar player) know what constitutes a song that is "us" and what is not. And only they know what venues are appropriate and which are not, etc. I've been hanging on because the guitar player has been my friend since we were playing guitars together at 15. I want to make sure we're still friends no matter what -- even if I think he's been brainwashed by the gloved one.

[klothos]

but it cracks me up that the name of the band is based on the number of people that were in the band. Personally I've always thought it was a stupid band name to begin with, being somewhat, um, suggestive and not in the most clever way. .

The Four Skins?

By the way: A Thread of War Stories and Band Member Debauchery would be more than entertaining.......

[Vic2012]

If you're band is playing Bon Jovi covers then just shoot yourself now......:lol

[klothos]

Ill address this individually


One in particular seems to control all booking (to our detriment), all the PA, and after several years I've recently discovered the mechanism by which he also controls all our song choices.

From my experience, it is always better for there to be one - and only ONE - band member actually negotiating the gigs, taking care of the calendar, dealing with the clients and acting as the band's spokesperson (basically, being the built-in agent). For one, it alleviates ANY discrepencies, such as comps/ shift-drinks/etc, money, start/break times, what is expected from the club-owner, so that there isnt any confusion about what all the details are. Its OK for the other band members to make contacts, for sure, but when it comes to actually securing the gig, use just one person

I also build bands as my my business venture -- it is how I make my money/my job - and, therefore, when it comes to my paycheck, I need to be as hands-on aabout it as possible. Just because a person is in your band NOW doesn't mean they will always be and that person may have ulterior motives when booking or dealing with the public. If a person books gigs for the band, then quits and tells you they are forming a new band and are taking the "clients that they dealt with" with them then, all of a sudden, you just lost a bunch of gigs


Our singer tried to book a gig near the area she lives. She's new to us in the last year or so and has been singing in bands for the last 20 years and has a TON of great contacts, a lot of which are from an area we've never played. Our keyboard player, whom we've not-so-affectionately nicknamed "Mittens", asked her if they had enough power for the band, saying "they've never seen a band like US before." I'm thinking "yeah, lucky for them", lol. This guy is all about having maximum PA wattage whether it's needed or not. I think he may be starting to see the light and he's starting to downsize. He downsized so much he's selling off a ton of microphones. He wants all the drums mic'ed, but he just sold off all the drum mics. "Well I told [the drummer] I'd give him a hell of a deal on the drum mics, but he didn't want to buy 'em." Sorry, but you just can't make somebody buy something. Our drummer is scraping by, and it's not like he was told upon joining the band he'd be responsible for supplying drum mics. Our drummer's argument is that he has never in all his years playing in various bands needed to mic his kit in his entire life - if the other guys want that it's their problem. This ended up in one of the most heated discussions the band has ever had a couple nights ago. They told him he needed to contact [a mutual friend] to borrow a kick mic. I was like, hey guys, I have a kick mic -- problem solved. Sheesh.

A big PA doesnt necessarily mean volume...As a matter of fact, if everyone is confident in their soundman's abilities and are confident that they are mixed adequately in the mains, your stage-volume should actually go DOWN. Also, this is 2014 -- a lot of players need to learn how to use the technology available to them --- especially with instrument amps and PA gear.......Setting up a GIANT 1980s style PA will make you LOOK loud, even if you aren't (Conversely, a small PA and compact backline will make you LOOK quieter, even if you are loud -- IT IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THAT PEOPLE, CUSTOMERS, AND CLUBOWNERS LISTEN WITH THEIR EYES


I also disagree about the drum mics: a drummer that owns drum mics when auditioning for any of my acts says volumes about that drummer's outlook and approach to his role as a player
[/QUOTE]





Mittens doesn't care though. Everything he does is passive-aggressive sabotage. Our singer called a local fair and negotiated $1000 gig. She then handed over the contact info to Mittens. It took 3 weeks before he followed up after he kept "losing" the contact info, etc. Somehow, when he got done, it was a $500 gig and he refused to play it because it was in a tent. WTF? And he has our guitar player convinced of his version of events. Our singer booked another place for her other band (she also has a band that does country stuff and sort of the country side of rock), she has known the guy who handles the booking for this place for years. She told Mittens that this place was booking up fast and asked if he had been in contact. "Oh yeah, so-and-so and I are working on some bigger, special projects this summer." So our singer asked the booking dude if he'd heard from Mittens. Nope.

^^ This is a shining example of why ONE person should deal with clients......You are clearly on the side of your singer but I don't know either of these people in your band, so - from my point of view reading this -- it is just as probable that your singer mis-interpreted the parameters of the gig as it is that Mittens dropped the ball.....



as always, your mileage may vary

[Plasmatopia]

There is very little in the way of debauchery in my band. Everyone is happily married. But lots of stupid stuff happens. There is one story from before I joined the band where someone said something stupid over the PA. The band was playing at a bar and during their first break went outside and noticed it was snowing like crazy. So the guitar player gets on the mic and says "I'm glad we have a lot of attractive ladies here, it looks like we're going to be snowed in". In minutes the place cleared out. Oops.

I've also witnessed our guitar player making the most ridiculously off-color jokes over the PA during afternoon and early evening outdoor "family" shows. Pretty embarrassing. He told us recently of someone who used to come to their shows and would bring a few friends who had stopped coming after he made some off-color priest jokes.

I was watching a video of us playing an afternoon outdoor benefit show from a couple years ago where someone wanted a female's birthday announced. There were kids running around everywhere. The guitar player (again) makes some crack about giving this person a spanking (but with a bit more suggested). On the video you can hear some woman saying "geez, she's only like 12 years old."

[Plasmatopia]

From my experience, it is always better for there to be one - and only ONE - band member actually negotiating the gigs, taking care of the calendar, dealing with the clients and acting as the band's spokesperson (basically, being the built-in agent). For one, it alleviates ANY discrepencies, such as comps/ shift-drinks/etc, money, start/break times, what is expected from the club-owner, so that there isnt any confusion about what all the details are. Its OK for the other band members to make contacts, for sure, but when it comes to actually securing the gig, use just one person

I also build bands as my my business venture -- it is how I make my money/my job - and, therefore, when it comes to my paycheck, I need to be as hands-on aabout it as possible. Just because a person is in your band NOW doesn't mean they will always be and that person may have ulterior motives when booking or dealing with the public. If a person books gigs for the band, then quits and tells you they are forming a new band and are taking the "clients that they dealt with" with them then, all of a sudden, you just lost a bunch of gigs

This is a good point. Although I've seen other friends/bands use multiple people to do the booking. It seems as though one person might initially have a good relationship with a venue and then is always the person who deals with that venue. But I agree that it makes sense to have one point of contact for consistency. The problem in our case is that I suspect that we may just as often lose a gig due to this person not being a very good representative for the band.

[Plasmatopia]

A big PA doesnt necessarily mean volume...As a matter of fact, if everyone is confident in their soundman's abilities and are confident that they are mixed adequately in the mains, your stage-volume should actually go DOWN. Also, this is 2014 -- a lot of players need to learn how to use the technology available to them --- especially with instrument amps and PA gear.......Setting up a GIANT 1980s style PA will make you LOOK loud, even if you aren't (Conversely, a small PA and compact backline will make you LOOK quieter, even if you are loud -- IT IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THAT PEOPLE, CUSTOMERS, AND CLUB OWNERS LISTEN WITH THEIR EYES

I also disagree about the drum mics: a drummer that owns drum mics when auditioning for any of my acts says volumes about that drummer's outlook and approach to his role as a player

^^ This is a shining example of why ONE person should deal with clients......You are clearly on the side of your singer but I don't know either of these people in your band, so - from my point of view reading this -- it is just as probable that your singer mis-interpreted the parameters of the gig as it is that Mittens dropped the ball...

You raise more good points. A couple of things make our circumstances different than what might exist outside out little world. We are in a fairly rural area and there aren't many around here that want to play this sort of music. I really don't know any better drummers that are willing to play the music we play (I can't blame them). And the powers-that-be in this band insist on practicing weekly (as much as possible). Anyone who really has it going on can do a couple of practices with us and pull it off. And we've flogged these tunes to death, believe me. The drummer and I personally are sick to death of this stuff. The other band I play with usually does a half dozen gigs every summer. We might have ONE practice (sometimes zero) before the first gig. We still manage to be tight. So there are not many that would commit to weekly practices of this material. They would want to be free to do other things.

But you are absolutely right. At this point I can't prove which person (the singer or Mittens) is telling the truth. She could be trying to undermine him I suppose. It's just that it would be much more consistent with his behavior to lie about this stuff. He shows many signs of insecurity and having to puff himself up.

The PA gear becomes a problem because it's a lot of work. The music is free - we get paid to set up the PA. We've just barely started to shorten setup time in the last few months. Prior to that we would take 3 hours to set up every time. And still it never sounded as good as the gear was capable of delivering. If they do get a sound guy they pick the one who is practically deaf, I'm not kidding. We do know some really good sound guys, but they're more expensive and besides, Mittens knows better than all of 'em. Money is a factor. Clubs seem to be paying less and less and we're still trying to bring way too much gear given the size of the venues. I went to see a friend's band a couple weeks ago. I sat about 3 feet in front of one speaker. The music was plenty loud to inspire dancers, everything was crystal clear, and yet we were still easily having conversations. It is WAY too loud at our shows. It can be "satisfyingly loud" and still not be painful, IMO.

[Plasmatopia]

If you're band is playing Bon Jovi covers then just shoot yourself now......:lol

I hear you. I don't listen to any of this music for pleasure. I avoid doing so at all costs. My other band plays traditional steel drum music. I don't listen to that in my spare time either. I still find it satisfying to play any music as long as it can be done well. There's just nothing quite like playing music with other people in real time.

But if this band were to fold I'd try to move on to some other style of music that I've never done before.

[klothos]

The PA gear becomes a problem because it's a lot of work. The music is free - we get paid to set up the PA.

This has been my mantra for decades



We've just barely started to shorten setup time in the last few months. Prior to that we would take 3 hours to set up every time. And still it never sounded as good as the gear was capable of delivering. If they do get a sound guy they pick the one who is practically deaf, I'm not kidding. We do know some really good sound guys, but they're more expensive and besides, Mittens knows better than all of 'em. Money is a factor. Clubs seem to be paying less and less and we're still trying to bring way too much gear given the size of the venues. I went to see a friend's band a couple weeks ago. I sat about 3 feet in front of one speaker. The music was plenty loud to inspire dancers, everything was crystal clear, and yet we were still easily having conversations. It is WAY too loud at our shows. It can be "satisfyingly loud" and still not be painful, IMO.

One big question here:

-- Is Mittens one of those anal-retentive musician/sound-guys with a ton of gear but most of it is all over a decade-and-a-half old and also thinks he knows everything?


If you're band is playing Bon Jovi covers then just shoot yourself now......:lol


I hear you. I don't listen to any of this music for pleasure. I avoid doing so at all costs.

I dunno: i can play a wiiiiiiide variety of styles although I consider my fortes funk, modern jazz, and urban blues....It still doesnt stop me from listening to Bon Jovi, Honeymoon Suite, or even a Warrant CD on occasion

[Rune Blackwings]

If you're band is playing Bon Jovi covers then just shoot yourself now......:lol

LOL


the name cannot be changed because "we've worked long and hard to develop our reputation".

I fully understand (Jefferson Airplane/Jefferson Starship) that logic (Hawkwind/Hawklords). You work very hard to establish a (cover) band and (copy) a style (Thou Shalt Suffer/Emperor) that you really cannot change it (On a Friday/Radiohead). You just (The Pendletons/the Beach Boys) might get people confused (Tom & Jerry/Simon & Garfunkel) and not come to your shows (The warlocks/The Grateful Dead).

[Jerjo]

On PE.2 there was a multi-page thread on band nightmares and bad gigs. If I recall, Luis Nasser had a terrifying and side-splitting story of playing a gig for a Mexican gang.

[No Pride]

There is very little in the way of debauchery in my band. Everyone is happily married. But lots of stupid stuff happens. There is one story from before I joined the band where someone said something stupid over the PA. The band was playing at a bar and during their first break went outside and noticed it was snowing like crazy. So the guitar player gets on the mic and says "I'm glad we have a lot of attractive ladies here, it looks like we're going to be snowed in". In minutes the place cleared out. Oops.

I've also witnessed our guitar player making the most ridiculously off-color jokes over the PA during afternoon and early evening outdoor "family" shows. Pretty embarrassing. He told us recently of someone who used to come to their shows and would bring a few friends who had stopped coming after he made some off-color priest jokes.

I was watching a video of us playing an afternoon outdoor benefit show from a couple years ago where someone wanted a female's birthday announced. There were kids running around everywhere. The guitar player (again) makes some crack about giving this person a spanking (but with a bit more suggested). On the video you can hear some woman saying "geez, she's only like 12 years old."
Out of several wedding/corporate party bands I've been in, there was one where the band leader fancied himself as the Don Rickles of that circuit. He would make fun of people's dancing on the mic and stuff like that. One time, this deaf girl wanted the band to play "That's What Friends Are For" while she "signed" the lyrics; it was intended as a gift to the bride and groom. So we did the tune while she signed and when it was over, this leader starts heading towards the microphone with a silly grin on his face. We're all simultaneously thinking, "whatever it is, don't do it, Joey!" So he gets on the mic and says, "Ah, the ideal woman, says what she has to say without opening her mouth." A deafening silence overtook the room, as everybody sat there, slack-jawed, while we're all looking for a rock to crawl under. On the break, I told him that I'm surprised he never gets the shit beat out of him at these gigs. He just laughed and said, "oh, it's happened a couple of times." Ah, memories...

[Plasmatopia]

Out of several wedding/corporate party bands I've been in, there was one where the band leader fancied himself as the Don Rickles of that circuit. He would make fun of people's dancing on the mic and stuff like that. One time, this deaf girl wanted the band to play "That's What Friends Are For" while she "signed" the lyrics; it was intended as a gift to the bride and groom. So we did the tune while she signed and when it was over, this leader starts heading towards the microphone with a silly grin on his face. We're all simultaneously thinking, "whatever it is, don't do it, Joey!" So he gets on the mic and says, "Ah, the ideal woman, says what she has to say without opening her mouth." A deafening silence overtook the room, as everybody sat there, slack-jawed, while we're all looking for a rock to crawl under. On the break, I told him that I'm surprised he never gets the shit beat out of him at these gigs. He just laughed and said, "oh, it's happened a couple of times." Ah, memories...

Good one!

[Plasmatopia]

I just created a group if anyone feels like joining.

[Mikhael]

Okay, I'm in. I'm constantly amazed by the amount of stupid drama that's in something you're supposed to be having fun doing. I'm in two bands; one original, and one cover. We now also share the same bassist, which has been a never-ending source of drama on the cover band's part. The ex-keyboardist of the cover band was a real PITA for me. He resented the fact that I knew more about music theory than he did, and could play his parts correctly (not the hard stuff). I walked on eggshells around this bugger for over a year, then at one gig, where he was playing a part 1/2 step off, he went ballistic on me, saying stuff like "You always have to be f#$%ing RIGHT, don't you? Nobody else is ever right, it's always you!" To which I responded that I only countered when I knew I WAS right, otherwise I kept my mouth shut and listened. This was after me trying to put it off, saying that stuff happens and we'll go over it in practice, and a couple of other things to try and calm him down. I was tired of pussyfooting around with him, and was ready to punch him if he started anything. Luckily, he got in his truck, slammed the door, and screeched out of the parking lot.

Later on, at practice, he found that sure enough, I WAS right. As usual. He clammed up, and never was friendly to me again. He eventually quit, thinking that would hurt us. I immediately called my friend from Gambit (a prog band), and asked him if he wanted to make a few bux playing in a copy band. He joined immediately, and having easily 10X the talent of the last guy, made us a better band. The old keyboardist was crestfallen that not only did we find someone quickly, but he was really good. It was a shame, since he had a decent voice, and was generally okay at the keys (although he continued to make clams up until the day after he left). I wouldn't have suggested any change in personnel - that was all his idea. But it's nice being without his bipolar nonsense.

And that's just one; I now play guitar in the original band, because we needed a guitarist (I was then the drummer) and couldn't find one (in Austin, TX even!) that was a good player and didn't have his head up his ass. I'm sure they're out there, but we couldn't find him in two years of looking. But we DID blunder on to a decent drummer, so...

Gambit folded because of the drummer. We had a GREAT one - I mean, talent just oozed out of this guy! His wife was a royal pain to deal with, and tried to run the band through him. It didn't last; he was a real nice guy, but the wife nagged him incessantly, and tried to change everything. We were an original prog band - the best band I've ever been in - and she just couldn't understand why we had to practice once a week, why we didn't play Eagles covers, etc. So she tried to control things, and eventually the band fell apart. A damn shame. A couple of years after the band folded we were still getting requests from Europe and South America for when we were going to release our next album. I still get pensive thinking about what could have been with that band.

So this stupid drama crap happens everywhere, every time. My road band, the singer got fired by the drummer and keyboardist, and he was dammn good - originally a backup singer for Lou Rawls. Well, the stories can go on and on, but I can't.

[TheLoony]

Oh yeah, I'm down for that group. I love these kinds of stories, as long as they are someone else's stories.

My old guitar player wanted to write pop rock like Warrant and White Lion, those types of bands from that era. I wanted to be the next incarnation of Rush. Needless to say, we had many heated discussions about how to write a song. As the guy said above, Ahhh, memories........

[NogbadTheBad]

Not a musician but I love these stories so I'm going to lurk :)

[Mikhael]

The group is now active, and people are actively whinin'... :)

[Guitarplyrjvb]

This topic is one of the main reasons we have home studio systems selling like hotcakes!

[Jefferson James]

I'm in. :)

[nosebone]

"whatever it is, don't do it, Joey!" :lol

OK, now I'm in!

[trurl]

I'm in, even though most of the kind of stuff like this that I went through is 30 years ago and I've blocked it all.

[No Pride]

"whatever it is, don't do it, Joey!" :lol

OK, now I'm in!
:D

As am I.

[Plasmatopia]

The group is now active, and people are actively whinin'... :)

I do what I can. :)

[dgtlman]

IN!

[JKL2000]

I rember in college I had a friend who played guitar in a nothing band that had done nothing but practice in our attic. He had never written a song, but one day declared he was writing a rock opera. He got as far as a short, repeating chorus and never mentioned it again.

LOL

[progeezer]

I've lived in Madison for more than 43 years.

What initially brought me to Wisconsin involved a band I was the singer in based in Lewiston, ME in 1970-71.

It was a 3 piece w/a frontman (me) with no keys. We did Hendrix, Love, Savoy Brown, Yardbirds etc. covers. I was born & raised in NYC, and the other 3 were all born & raised in Madison. They came to Maine looking for a singer since they had a place there to live and practice, and didn't in WI.

All I knew about Madison was that it was the state capitol, but when our guitarist took acid before a gig and didn't tell the rest of the band, and midway through the gig stumbled around enough on stage to have the top amp of his Marshall stack fall on him mid-song ("Bummer In The Summer" by Love) and stagger offstage, the drummer (still a friend to this day) asked if I would go to Madison with him to start a different band. I did, and after 5 kids and a 25 year career in WI state government I'm still here. We learned a few months later that the guitar player had matriculated to heroin shortly after that incident. Don't know if he's still alive or not, but I know what I'd lay my money down on.:(

[Hobo Chang Ba]

Thankfully the band I'm in spends most of it's time in different states so I rarely have to worry about serious stuff. :p

I'll join the group though.

[jupiter0rjapan]

Oh, so much of that mirrors my time in a cover band. I only joined one cover band in my life, and I started out as the drummer. When I first joined, everything was pretty cool. I really never wanted to be in a cover band, but these guys seemed pretty cool and they were amazing musicians. Nothing was half-assed, and everyone in the band could sing and harmonize. A rare breed. There would be some heated arguments over music, but it seemed ok.

After a year, I was starting to see the cracks in the pretty facade. The guitar player had all the power in the band, which he was fairly subtle about wielding when I first joined. Later on, it became more obvious. He owned the PA, he booked the gigs, he had his own drums at his house so all we had to do is just show up and play. It was a dream set up for sure, but then when it came time to get his way, all of a sudden all that stuff he did out of the "kindness" of his heart became tools to guilt people into caving to any of his demands. The rehearsals started becoming torture sessions of playing the same song over and over and over just because one member missed a note. The song would get worse as the night would wear on, because everyone was tired of playing it, and we would have to mutiny and refuse to play it, which would turn into an hour long argument about "dedication". Our fearless leader was so convinced that our 5 piece cover band playing a $350 gig at some shithole was a concert that could make or break the band. During some of these practices, our fearless leader would get so drunk and stoned he could barely keep his eyes open. Yet he was so concerned about us "getting it right". I was stone cold sober for 99.9 of our practices and gigs. As the drummer, I felt like I had to be clear to get the job done right, and I have always been that way. I didn't care what the other members do as long as they delivered. I have since lost that silly idea and now believe that it ALWAYS interferes with performance, just in subtle ways.

The truth is, we were pretty damn good. We could get even the most apathetic crowds on our side though sheer force and determination. We left nothing in reserve and gave it our all. At first, it was worth all the headaches, but it got much worse at the practices and sometimes even at the gigs.

There was a consensus from the audience and within the band that I was a better singer than our lead singer. he could play the drums too, so we would switch for a few songs a night. This was a death sentence for our poor lead singer, as I have a very powerful voice, and the crowds would often not want me to go back to the drums after a few AC/DC or Mountain tunes. Our lead singer really could not sing the blues at all, and that shit is my bread and butter. Somehow, the guy would not let me sing the Joe Cocker tunes, which was just idiotic. He also started singing flat all the time. When I joined, he sounded fine. I'm not sure what happened, but his pitch seemed to worsen as time went on. He also had another band that was booking shows at the same venues, and our band leader did not like that one bit. After a while we decided to hire a new drummer and put me in the lead vocal spot. So ends pt. 1 of my story. It gets much worse, if you want to hear it let me know...

[trurl]

I was in a cover band years ago and we fired our drummer because he would only practice 5 nights a week... bastard! One night off is enough for anyone! He shouldn't even want that! Ah, the idiocy of youth :p

We were at a battle of the bands once though and the guy dropped both his sticks at the same time, so we were probably looking for any excuse.

[No Pride]

when our guitarist took acid before a gig and didn't tell the rest of the band, and midway through the gig stumbled around enough on stage to have the top amp of his Marshall stack fall on him mid-song ("Bummer In The Summer" by Love) and stagger offstage, the drummer (still a friend to this day) asked if I would go to Madison with him to start a different band.
He couldn't have picked a more appropriate song title for that. :lol


The guitar player had all the power in the band, which he was fairly subtle about wielding when I first joined. Later on, it became more obvious. He owned the PA, he booked the gigs, he had his own drums at his house so all we had to do is just show up and play. It was a dream set up for sure, but then when it came time to get his way, all of a sudden all that stuff he did out of the "kindness" of his heart became tools to guilt people into caving to any of his demands. The rehearsals started becoming torture sessions of playing the same song over and over and over just because one member missed a note. The song would get worse as the night would wear on, because everyone was tired of playing it, and we would have to mutiny and refuse to play it, which would turn into an hour long argument about "dedication". Our fearless leader was so convinced that our 5 piece cover band playing a $350 gig at some shithole was a concert that could make or break the band. During some of these practices, our fearless leader would get so drunk and stoned he could barely keep his eyes open. Yet he was so concerned about us "getting it right".
If there's anything worse than having a control freak in a band, it's having one that doesn't hold himself to the same standards that he expects out of everyone else. I've had some first hand experience with a few guys like that. If you want the respect of others, you have to earn it.

[Plasmatopia]

I was in a cover band years ago and we fired our drummer because he would only practice 5 nights a week... bastard! One night off is enough for anyone! He shouldn't even want that! Ah, the idiocy of youth :p

We were at a battle of the bands once though and the guy dropped both his sticks at the same time, so we were probably looking for any excuse.

Unconscionable of him!

[Plasmatopia]

If you want the respect of others, you have to earn it.

Unless you're the one signing the paychecks.

[Hobo Chang Ba]

Oh, so much of that mirrors my time in a cover band. I only joined one cover band in my life, and I started out as the drummer. When I first joined, everything was pretty cool. I really never wanted to be in a cover band, but these guys seemed pretty cool and they were amazing musicians. Nothing was half-assed, and everyone in the band could sing and harmonize. A rare breed. There would be some heated arguments over music, but it seemed ok.

After a year, I was starting to see the cracks in the pretty facade. The guitar player had all the power in the band, which he was fairly subtle about wielding when I first joined. Later on, it became more obvious. He owned the PA, he booked the gigs, he had his own drums at his house so all we had to do is just show up and play. It was a dream set up for sure, but then when it came time to get his way, all of a sudden all that stuff he did out of the "kindness" of his heart became tools to guilt people into caving to any of his demands. The rehearsals started becoming torture sessions of playing the same song over and over and over just because one member missed a note. The song would get worse as the night would wear on, because everyone was tired of playing it, and we would have to mutiny and refuse to play it, which would turn into an hour long argument about "dedication". Our fearless leader was so convinced that our 5 piece cover band playing a $350 gig at some shithole was a concert that could make or break the band. During some of these practices, our fearless leader would get so drunk and stoned he could barely keep his eyes open. Yet he was so concerned about us "getting it right". I was stone cold sober for 99.9 of our practices and gigs. As the drummer, I felt like I had to be clear to get the job done right, and I have always been that way. I didn't care what the other members do as long as they delivered. I have since lost that silly idea and now believe that it ALWAYS interferes with performance, just in subtle ways.

The truth is, we were pretty damn good. We could get even the most apathetic crowds on our side though sheer force and determination. We left nothing in reserve and gave it our all. At first, it was worth all the headaches, but it got much worse at the practices and sometimes even at the gigs.

There was a consensus from the audience and within the band that I was a better singer than our lead singer. he could play the drums too, so we would switch for a few songs a night. This was a death sentence for our poor lead singer, as I have a very powerful voice, and the crowds would often not want me to go back to the drums after a few AC/DC or Mountain tunes. Our lead singer really could not sing the blues at all, and that shit is my bread and butter. Somehow, the guy would not let me sing the Joe Cocker tunes, which was just idiotic. He also started singing flat all the time. When I joined, he sounded fine. I'm not sure what happened, but his pitch seemed to worsen as time went on. He also had another band that was booking shows at the same venues, and our band leader did not like that one bit. After a while we decided to hire a new drummer and put me in the lead vocal spot. So ends pt. 1 of my story. It gets much worse, if you want to hear it let me know...

Do it.

[klothos]

If there's anything worse than having a control freak in a band, it's having one that doesn't hold himself to the same standards that he expects out of everyone else. I've had some first hand experience with a few guys like that. If you want the respect of others, you have to earn it.


+1000000000

[Mikhael]

I'm not a control freak, but I do have some hot points that bug me. I want the band to sound good and put on a professional show. Beyond that I don't care. But it's amazing how hard it is to accomplish those two points; you'd think that anyone wanting to be in a performing band would want those two points as well. However...

[Plasmatopia]

One big question here:

-- Is Mittens one of those anal-retentive musician/sound-guys with a ton of gear but most of it is all over a decade-and-a-half old and also thinks he knows everything?

I dunno: i can play a wiiiiiiide variety of styles although I consider my fortes funk, modern jazz, and urban blues....It still doesnt stop me from listening to Bon Jovi, Honeymoon Suite, or even a Warrant CD on occasion

That is definitely Mittens to a "t".

Not trying to denigrate Bon Jovi, et al - it's just not something I particularly enjoy. I have no problem if people enjoy that stuff.