RIO 2015 reviews & thoughts

[NogbadTheBad]

I was happy to see them booked, there have always been a bunch of what I would consider non-RIO/Avant at the festival. Soft Machine, Caravan, Gong seemed to be pretty good fits despite their more Canterbury leanings. Many of the young French bands or Japanese bands seem to be more fusiony. The biggest missteps to my mind have been Arno & Young Gods but I'm sure Michel had good reasons for booking both. On that basis I find it hard to argue with the M&M booking.

[flytomars]

just to clarify:

I'm not objecting to people not liking them or not liking them so much. You don't have to justify that - at least not to me.

I am a bit surprised that people think they 'don't belong at RIO' or 'don't deserve to be RIO'. That is what I am posting about.

Fair enough, but I would like to hear your reasoning for the bolded part.

[Steve F.]

Fair enough, but I would like to hear your reasoning for the bolded part.

Why I think they belong?

[flytomars]

Why I think they belong?

Yes, and also I find it surprising that it is surprising for you that people think they don't belong

[Steve F.]

I think they belong because it is interesting, complex original music performed from their hearts under difficult situations for the musicians. Like much of the other stuff at RIO.

And I am a inclusive guy, not an exclusive guy when it comes to this stuff. Look at what we release. IMO: The people who make this music and present this music either hang together or they hang by their necks on their own.

Did Fred Frith playing solo guitar belong?

Does Offering belong, other than the fact that it's the guy from Magma?

Does Ukandanz belong? It's just a variation of the Ethiopian pop of the 70s.

Does Alec K. Redfearn belong? He writes little songs and plays them on the accordion. What does that have to do with RIO?

YMMV, but : I think they all belong. Whether or not I like them or want to see them is another story. But they all belong.

Otherwise, it's turns into the garbage that I used to have flung at me. "Univers Zero don't belong at NEARFest - they don't deserve to be there!"

I say:

"Why not? Because you don't appreciate them? If you you have to like everything at a festival dedicated to 'new music' for it to be justified, then you are missing the point. imo"

[Lebofsky]

I repeat what I said earlier - I loved the M/M set, and in fact that was possibly my favorite set of the whole festival.

They were awesome. They were fun. They totally belonged. I was excited to see them. I wasn't disappointed.

- Matt

[Levgan]

I don't think Mats & Morgan belong to RIO (as a genre).

I think they perfectly belong at RIO (as a festival).

[NogbadTheBad]

I don't think Mats & Morgan belong to RIO (as a genre).

I think they perfectly belong at RIO (as a festival).

Agreed.

[Phlakaton]

Someone needs to put a nice bow and wrapping on what the hell the RIO "genre" is then. Because it's like someone hijacking the original intent of Jeet Kun Do for their own uses - sidestepping what Bruce Lee's idea was. The original intent was - and please tell me if I'm wrong - to have a place for music and musicians who create pretty different music that is shunned by record labels... and has no ground to stand on when it comes to being released by labels. So the different and unique music could live on in a festival environment - or through some other means - collectively if you will. I could be totally wrong but that is how I understand the original intent.

I would think lots of different things could apply... avant-garde - prog - complexity with melody - dunno... the whole mess thrown together and the kitchen sink of music.

[flytomars]

I think they belong because it is interesting, complex original music performed from their hearts under difficult situations for the musicians. Like much of the other stuff at RIO.

OK, interesting is in the ear of the beholder, complex is something that can be said about a lot of things which are not RIO (from math rock to academic classical music), and performed from their hearts under difficult situations for the musicians can be said on every street performer in your nearest train station.
All these traits might be symptoms of RIO, but are not necessarily the diagnosis.
I do not agree to your assessment that these make MM a RIO outfit.
That said, I do agree with Levgan that they do have a place in the festival, as do Aquaserge and Toubifri and Ukandanz (3 of the top 5 shows for me in this RIO) which I also don't think fit in the RIO paradigm.
If this means that in a festival of more than 10 bands, one or 2 shows are just OK and not mind-blowing, so be it
I am definitely not complaining, I think the RIO festival is the best music festival there is (honestly, I missed only 2 mabe 3 times and in the times I did go I discovered tons of amazing music)
And I think Michel should win a Noble prize for making it happen but that's beside the point.

[flytomars]

Someone needs to put a nice bow and wrapping on what the hell the RIO "genre" is then. Because it's like someone hijacking the original intent of Jeet Kun Do for their own uses - sidestepping what Bruce Lee's idea was. The original intent was - and please tell me if I'm wrong - to have a place for music and musicians who create pretty different music that is shunned by record labels... and has no ground to stand on when it comes to being released by labels. So the different and unique music could live on in a festival environment - or through some other means - collectively if you will. I could be totally wrong but that is how I understand the original intent.

I would think lots of different things could apply... avant-garde - prog - complexity with melody - dunno... the whole mess thrown together and the kitchen sink of music.

I agree with all said above, I just don't see M&M as different music? I mean, just go to the nearest jazz club to your home and if the band will be on the electric side, it wont sound a thousand years away from M&M...
Mabe less dexterous and virtuoso, but those are not traits I consider highly of, sorry.

[Phlakaton]

I agree with all said above, I just don't see M&M as different music? I mean, just go to the nearest jazz club to your home and if the band will be on the electric side, it wont sound a thousand years away from M&M...
Mabe less dexterous and virtuoso, but those are not traits I consider highly of, sorry.

If I went to my nearest jazz club and heard anything remotely close to M/M my head would explode. I guess we just dont agree on this one. All good. I'll just enjoy it all without the labels. Cheers!

[Levgan]

The original intent was - and please tell me if I'm wrong - to have a place for music and musicians who create pretty different music that is shunned by record labels... and has no ground to stand on when it comes to being released by labels. So the different and unique music could live on in a festival environment - or through some other means - collectively if you will. I could be totally wrong but that is how I understand the original intent.

Your understanding is correct, but then again, the original intent of progressive rock was to be progressive So likewise, this is not a case of someone deliberately hijacking the genre here or undermining its principles out of ill will, but rather simply of words changing their meanings as time goes by. The ideology behind RIO hasn't aged very well IMO, but the music has, and since it was defined by certain few bands, it is only natural that their compositional style became blueprint for a genre.

[Steve F.]

... complex is something that can be said about a lot of things which are not RIO (from math rock to academic classical music).... which I also don't think fit in the RIO paradigm.

Well, unless you want to say "it has to sound like avant-garde rock music of 40 years ago", which I hope you would not want to say, I would merely comment "WHAT RIO paradigm"?

some 'academic classical music' isn't that far from Art Zoyd

and

I personally wouldn't mind seeing some math-rock there. YMMV

[boilk]

Can anyone give more thoughts on the Happy Family set? It seemed like a lot people weren't that into them. They were one of the top reasons that I really wanted to go this year. Did they play The Sushi Bar from Tossco, which is, in my opinion, one amazing song.

neil

[Steve F.]

Can anyone give more thoughts on the Happy Family set?

They didn't belong either!

[boilk]

They didn't belong either!

HA!!

neil

[NogbadTheBad]

They rocked, I liked them.

[zombywoof]

As far as I'm concerned, as a pretty average music fanatic with a basic familiarity of most bands in the lineup, Mats Morgan were the major draw of this festival ... behind perhaps Secret Chiefs 3.

[FredOCal]

I saw Happy Family at the last two RiO festivals and they were great both times. My buddy who came with me this time thought they were one of the highlights and I agree. I almost reinjured my my leg dancing around. I enjoyed every set. I had seen Mats/Morgan, Secret Chiefs, Present and Happy Family before and they were the draws for me. Ukandanz was such a pleasant surprise, as was the final show. The Eyesores boasted some beautiful vocals, which were a welcome change from the screaming/rough vocals that started to sound a bit samey. It was the first time I had ever heard Art Zoyd, much less seen them and they were another pleasant surprise. I had no idea what to expect and I really enjoyed their set. Hanging out with Kerman, Keith, Udi and Steve was a blast and I hope to catch everyone again soon. I didn't realize so many of members went, but I do realize that I met Ian there. Great meeting you Ian!

[Trane]

I think the negativity is being overstated a bit from my perspective, I just didn't enjoy their set as much as I did some of the other bands or as much as I expected. I didn't have an issue with the attire or the keys sound at all. My thing is I'm not a big fan of over noodly fusion and fusion in a live setting seems to often be over noodly. I has the same experience with RTF, every damn song had at least one solo and often more. In the case of M&M every track seemed to be a set up for a Morgan freakout. I like Morgan freakouts just not in ever track. There was a lack of structure to the tracks, they seemed to meander. That said I'll happily go and see them again and buy more stuff. They just weren't top 5 at the festival for me.

I actually love JR/F (it's my most-reviewed genre on PA), but for some reasons, I even have trouble considering M&M that (though they clearly are a much better fit there than in RIO).

BTW, I just realized that I write M&M instead of M/M... maybe because their silly outfits and stage acts make me think subliminaly of the M&M candies and the stupid TV commercial ads.

I was happy to see them booked, there have always been a bunch of what I would consider non-RIO/Avant at the festival. Soft Machine, Caravan, Gong seemed to be pretty good fits despite their more Canterbury leanings. Many of the young French bands or Japanese bands seem to be more fusiony.

What I don't get is that outside Magma/Vander (and to a lesser extent Guapo), Michel seems to shun Zeuhl (In a way Zeuhl is like Canterbury, very JR/F related) ... there are plenty of young French Zeuhl bands that could use a little exposition from the RIO Fest.

The biggest missteps to my mind have been Arno & Young Gods but I'm sure Michel had good reasons for booking both. On that basis I find it hard to argue with the M&M booking.

my guess is that he needed the crowds (ticket sales revenues) these bands brought, partly to not lose too much money, but also show he can be flexible towards the authorities that subsidy the RIO festival... I'm sure there are many tactical politics issues at stakes... It's all too often the case with arts subsidies in Western Europe. This is a constant fight, to be started again almost every new year.

I think they belong because it is interesting, complex original music performed from their hearts under difficult situations for the musicians. Like much of the other stuff at RIO.

Fair enough Steve... Although if I don't understand why they brought them back for a second time, I can't feel sad because there is one band that fits outside what I (little old me) perceive as RIO

They didn't belong either!

Good one.

I saw Happy Family at the last two RiO festivals and they were great both times!

Probably that HF was much more at ease at the Japanese RIO Fest.

[NogbadTheBad]

Hi Fred! Was great to meet you, welcome to the gang

Trane, agree with you on the Zeuhl, I'd love to see regular spots for the great young French Zeuhl bands, or someone like Corima.

[Levgan]

So is this turning into "who should play on the next RIO" thing?

Then please consider my polite vote for Polite Refusal (a.k.a. Vezhlivy Otkaz). Yes, bringing a band from our neck of woods is probably not very cheap, but it did not prevent RIO from booking Rational Diet a few years ago (I don't think flights from Minsk are significantly cheaper than those from Moscow). I'm pretty sure they can easily get in touch with VO via Altrock who distributes their CDs and does a great job with it, but if my help is needed, I'm at Michel's (or anyone else's) disposal. I know all of the guys personally, they're all very nice people, and the bass player is an old friend of mine.

[flytomars]

So is this turning into "who should play on the next RIO" thing?

Then please consider my polite vote for Polite Refusal (a.k.a. Vezhlivy Otkaz). Yes, bringing a band from our neck of woods is probably not very cheap, but it did not prevent RIO from booking Rational Diet a few years ago (I don't think flights from Minsk are significantly cheaper than those from Moscow). I'm pretty sure they can easily get in touch with VO via Altrock who distributes their CDs and does a great job with it, but if my help is needed, I'm at Michel's (or anyone else's) disposal. I know all of the guys personally, they're all very nice people, and the bass player is an old friend of mine.

Ive seen them twice already but wouldnt mind seeing them again

[Trane]

So is this turning into "who should play on the next RIO" thing?

The question was asked in the questionaire handed out from Saturday evening onwards...

However, I don't think one needs to get his hopes up to high about these suggestions, cos I heard Michel and the gang are not easily influenced... not to mention that they're probably flooded with demands.