The first two albums are the most prog I've heard from them. First album reminds me of Gentle Giant at times.Originally Posted by JKL2000
The first two albums are the most prog I've heard from them. First album reminds me of Gentle Giant at times.
I once read an interview with Andy Latimer in which he said Ton Scherpenzeel was the best keyboardplayer he had worked with. Alas Ton Scherpenzeel is affraid of flying, which made things difficult.
RBB was the album where they really hit the “prog pop” style that they ran with for the balance of their career. I mean, it was there from the start, but those first two albums seemed to be trying to be “real” prog, especially the second, and even there they threw in the odd poppy track like “Wintertime” or “Alibi.” See See the Sun seems to be playing both sides of the fence, being comprised of half epic-prog numbers and half shorter songs. Beginning with RBB, the closest we came to “epics” were their concentrated “mini-epics” like “Said No Word,” “Daphne” or Starlight Dancer’s title track. Of course, there’s the anomaly of Merlin’s A-side, which seems to be borne of Irene Linders’ ambition to create a concept piece based on Arthurian legend.
Confirmed Bachelors: the dramedy hit of 1883...
I've always heard the name. I popped that First 5 box on my want list to try and catch up.
I picked up that First Five Box Set a couple years ago when it was released. All remastered and really hits the spot for some prime Kayak. I have sampled their later output, but it got a bit samey to me. Those first five though! Only downside is that the book and notes are in Dutch, but I can live with it. One thing I did learn with that box is that the USA releases of these albums differed a bit from the European releases (the discs themselves represent the European release). The Bonus 6th disc includes the songs that were added/switched out on the American versions, so you get it all.
Sweet! Looking forward to it.
I was talking to a guy who played in some kind of punk/indie band in a bar around 1993/94 or so. Somehow I got into talking to him about progressive rock. I don't remember which bands we talked about but I think Yes and King Crimson. I remember him saying he liked relayer. We got really into a heavy prog conversation but considering the time period the conversation only went so far. I think I mentioned some obscure bands (well, at least obscure to me at the time but I don't remember which ones) and at one point he asked me if I heard of Kayak. I told him I did although I didn't know their music at that time. I always found it interesting that this guy who was probably around my age (mid 20s or so at the time) had heard of Kayak.
Anyway, I did eventually hear and own some of their 70s albums but at the moment I only have one of their later ones but I forget which one. It is pretty good though. If I find it I'll listen again or at least mention which one it is.
Last edited by Digital_Man; 07-15-2022 at 12:29 AM.
Do not suffer through the game of chance that plays....always doors to lock away your dreams (To Be Over)
Truly the only significantly different album, musically, was Starlight Dancer. “Want You to Be Mine” and “Irene” were re-recorded from the ground up, and most of the other tracks actually came from the previous album, The Last Encore, with the exception of “Ballad for a Lost Friend,” a B-side track actually recorded at the sessions for the next album, Phantom of the Night. That means only two tracks—“Turn the Tide” and the title track—are present and not tampered with from the original Dutch version of the LP.
The main difference with the American version of Royal Bed Bouncer (apart from the cover, of course) is that it was subjected to a slight remix to remove any track segues/transitions. Musically, the US version of Phantom of the Night is the same as the Dutch version, except it has a completely different track order. All three of these albums had different covers (the Janus version of SD’s cover actually being a revised version of The Last Encore’s cover). See See the Sun and Periscope Life are identical to their European versions, though the latter (which was recorded in L.A.) is the only one with the same cover in all territories. The self-titled second and Merlin never even received releases in the Americas.
Confirmed Bachelors: the dramedy hit of 1883...
Does anybody know how the sound quality on the First Five box compares to the versions of those albums that appear on the Journey Through Time box? I'm trying to find reviews and it's quite difficult to get anything from Google that isn't a literal Kayak.
Listen to my music at https://electricbrainelectricshadow.bandcamp.com/
^^ I find Google in general is becoming less and less of a reliable source to find obscure information. The internet everyone uses, not part of the Tor Network/Dark Web is becoming more and more sparse.
"Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama
Incidentally, it looks like the Journey Through Time box set is the only way to get all of the orphaned single tracks, including the Plan single which I don’t think has ever been released on CD before. A bit of a shame it’s a rich man’s luxury item (like most box sets).
Confirmed Bachelors: the dramedy hit of 1883...
I saw Ton Scherpenzeel play keyboards with Camel in Krakow, Poland, a few years ago and I figured that would be as close as I would ever get to seeing Kayak play live... until my wife and I decided to fly from the U.S. to the Netherlands to visit the country at the height of tulip season and see the band on its farewell tour. Finally getting to see one of my favorite bands play in their homeland was an unforgettable experience.
Before the show, I asked Irene Linders (the band's lyricist and Ton's missus) if there was any chance that the band might come out after the show. She said it was "unlikely, due to Covid." So you can imagine my delight when the band appeared at the merch table after the concert in Groningen. Getting the chance to meet and chat with Scherpenzeel after the show was like an out-of-body experience. I never could have imagined that I would get to talk with the keyboard master face-to-face, let alone ever see Kayak on stage. He seemed genuinely touched that we had come all the way from the U.S. to north Holland to see his band. “I hope we did not disappoint you” was his sincere reply.
Kayak does not plan to tour again (their final show, ironically, was cancelled due to covid, so no "Last Encore"), but Scherpenzeel said "it is our hope" that the band will continue to record.
The show I saw, incidentally, was fantastic.
kayak4541.jpg
That's awesome, man. I'm really glad you got to see them, and to meet Ton. Thanks for sharing that.
"what's better, peanut butter or g-sharp minor?"
- Sturgeon's Lawyer, 2021
^ Mark, my memory may be faulty, and I'm not even close to sure, but...Were you in Grand Rapids and had a Prog CD mail order company, once upon a long time ago?
Wow, you get points for being very close. I do live in Grand Rapids and while I never had a Prog CD mail order company, I do sell now on Discogs (mostly my extras from my large – and still growing – collection). I am friends with people here like Herm Baker (Vertigo) and Scott Teasdale (GRCD) who started Vinyl Solution back in the 80s so it's possible your brain put me together with them but I would hardly say your memory is faulty! I would say it's pretty good.
Where is Planet Lovetron? Do we know each other from shows?
The Planet Lovetron is just a throwaway Darryl Dawkins reference. He was an NBA player for the 76ers back in the late 70s & 80s, who nicknamed himself "The Baby Gorilla," said he was from the Planet Lovetron, and called his dunks "Chocolate Thunder." He was quite a character, and a good player too. However, I actually live in central Northern Ohio.
I'm not sure where I remember your name from, but I'm sure that I do. There was a guy selling CDs via mailorder out of GR back in the 90s, and I was also aware of a DJ on a GR FM station who played Marillion, which resulted in GR becoming something of a hot spot for them in the US, but I don't recall his name. I saw Marillion in GR in 1987, but I'm pretty sure that was before I was aware of you in any way. So, a bit of a mystery, but if I recalled your name and city, there's a reason behind that. I just don't recall what it is.
EDIT: I just noticed your information on the left shows you living in Grand Rapids, but I hadn't noticed that when I asked the initial question.
Good stuff about Dawkins. I remember the bit about Chocolate Thunder but not the rest.
The DJ is Aris Hampers who was responsible for making Grand Rapids a prog hotspot of sorts. He had an import show called "Music Not From Around Here" where he featured bands like Banco, Grobschnitt, Secret Oyster, and lots of Italian prog obscurities (too numerous to list) but he also played bands like Barclay James Harvest, Greenslade, and Kayak in regular rotation (before the arrival of radio consultants). He was knowledgeable about music because he had been a talented keyboardist who fronted local bands (see the Phlegethon clips I've included, Aris used to segue them together on the air; Last Voyage Home was a local radio which almost landed the band a national record deal). He had one of the best radio voices; sadly he got cancer and lost his voice a couple of years ago.
I was at the 1987 Marillion show after having seen them twice in 1983 during their first US tour, but I think you're right that's not how we know each other. You're from Ohio? Were you friends with Gary Schin? We might have met at ROSfest or the prog festival that was held in Pittsburgh.
I was reading an article the other day about the decline of Google. If I understood it right, they've tried to focus the algorithm more on what they expect you to be looking for and less on careful appraisal of your actual search terms, which is helpful for the majority of people who want to find Kayaks but less helpful for the minority who want info about a specific release of the band Kayak. That's especially true in the case of a release like "The First Five" where every word in that title is incredibly generic and common.
Anyway -- I did find a cheap copy of First Five for sale, and also the Esoteric See See the Sun, so I guess in a few days when those arrive I'll be able to do a blind comparison with the Journey Through Time version and see if any of them sound appreciably different from each other. No matter what I'll probably put my copy of Journey Through Time on eBay.
Listen to my music at https://electricbrainelectricshadow.bandcamp.com/
Not familiar with Gary Schin, but I was at the 2nd 3RP festival in Pittsburgh. I can't help thinking that I became familiar with you in the 80s or 90s, but...<shrugs.>
Thanks for the Phlegethon clips. That's the first I've heard of them, and I keep a pretty good ear to the ground for American Prog-Rock from the 70s & 80s. A little looking around on the web, and I found an ebay listing in which he sells a CD+ of his 2 bands - https://www.discogs.com/release/4939...apes-1967-1971 . I ordered it. He says in the listing that stocks are getting low.
OK, sorry for the detour folks. On me.
Yeah, that too. I find Google's results to be littered with irrelevant garbage, as the likes Excite and Alta Vista were back in the day. What made Google special was it surpassed all that.
But with the dominance of social media, running a website is becoming superfluous. And needlessly expensive. Most kids need the Instagram or TikTok apps on their phone far more than they need a browser.
"Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama
After listening to their first 5 albums for years...I then heard Merlin and really liked the first 4 songs which reminded me of a suite, but are not connected as such. The rest of the album was Pop Music. The first 4 songs are more progressive and theatrical sounding. Quite different from the first 5 albums. I am mainly pointing out that the first 4 songs are worth the purchase of the cd. Merlin from the 70s ..not the re-recorded version.
Even though I ultimately don't have much passion toward any of the Reekers material, there's something about the song "Boogie Heart" from the second half of Merlin that moves me, even though instrumentally it's a lightweight rock song with quite generic riffing. The theme of being isolated & lonely but having music to keep you company resonates, based on personal experience.
Listen to my music at https://electricbrainelectricshadow.bandcamp.com/
Trust In The Machine was a strange song. It featured Mellotron and came across very dark
The song "Phantom Of The Night" was reminiscent of Procol Harum to me and it sounded similar to the style on Grand Hotel in some ways, but probably because of the orchestra.
Phantom Of The Night affects me personally because I lost a friend to the sea. He went overboard and the lyricism to the song cuts deep.
I was dragged across the ocean floor , ( not deep), but during a severe storm. Certain Prog songs about the sea paint a visual for me. Prog is deep and will reflect personal experiences you may have
Merlin is from 1981. I think Ton and Irene originally intended the whole album to be a conceptual piece all about Merlin (was somebody reading The Crystal Cave, perhaps?) but the record company forced them to compromise. They finally did the full-length concept as intended in the 90s. Irene seems to love her historical/mythological themes, as songs like "Daphne (Laurel Tree)" (based on the myth of Apollo and Daphne) and "Anne" (about Anne Boleyn, tragic wife of Henry VIII and mother of Elizabeth I) popped up like mushrooms after she joined.
I have a fondness for "Love's Aglow." On the surface, it's just a standard MOR love ballad, but the arrangement is just exquisite, similar to "Irene." And it's a rarity in that it's (to my knowledge) the only Kayak song on which Ton Scherpenzeel sings lead.
Those synthesized "machine" sounds in the middle are well-done. Creepy and effective.
Confirmed Bachelors: the dramedy hit of 1883...
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