King Crimson News

[Rarebird]

The documentary on King Crimson https://www.progressiveears.org/foru...on+documentary will be broadcasted on Belgian public television tonight.

[notallwhowander]

Hello... It has been a while.

I popped in to say that I attended the first night of the Robert Fripp & David Singleton Q&A tour, here in Santa Cruz. Singleton mentioned the last Club release, and they teased some of the video footage that will come with the release. We were told, we were the first to see it.

More spoilers, I suppose, so be forewarned...



Overall, it was a delightful night. It is well worth going if you ever majorly geeked out on KC, and spent time reading Fripp's obscure and mystical theories about music and performance. Each hour was bookended by select video clips, including an amazing vid of Fracture being played by the last KC line up.

I was one of the first questions, sensing that someone had to break the ice. Not being a musician, I asked Fripp about the end of the world, and what wisdom he gained in his inquiries and contemplations. Cheers to both of them, they took my question seriously. Fripp threw to Singleton so he had time to gather his thoughts, something that happened several times through the night.

I picked up a cool bit of merch. All three sets of Guitar Craft aphorism cards ($100) and a bit of nice A4 paper, with what I can only describe as a artistic smear of gold and silver paints, with a handwritten signed and dated quote: Music is the glass that holds the wine of silence ($50), each one unique, etc. I'll be looking to frame and hang that. There was also available a signed copy of Fripp's The Guitar Circle book, a true doorstopper that apparently holds his accumulated philosophy on music, guitar, perfromace, etc. I did not buy this, because I knew I would not read it in the foreseeable future. If I have a change of heart, I will have to content myself with an unsigned copy through the usual channels. Singleton had some Vicar stuff at the table too, but I wasn't there to buy large, and kept my purchases to cash in pocket.

Good to report back to you all again.

Cheers!

[calyx]

Some interesting reading in Fripp's latest diary entry, where he shares letters/e-mails he sent to fellow KC members in the 1990s -

https://dgmlive.com/diaries/Robert%2...02-22-rf-diary

There are details of financial arrangements (sharing of record sales, songwriting royalties, etc.), and of particular interest, what I would call a chronicle of Bill Bruford's eventual departure from KC. Bill's book offers an inaccurate, I suppose misremembered, account of it, where he basically states that he left after the unsuccessful Nashville writing sessions in May 1997. But here are details of continuing discussions up to the first half of 1999 where Bruford was still included in future plans, although his disinclination to use electronic drums at this point compromised his involvement in what Fripp had in mind of the next stage of KC. This had already been documented, albeit in less detail, but what I was unaware of was the expressed concerns over the noise level during rehearsals, where the decision to only use electronic drums was partly to do with keeping the level down, as opposed to the use of acoustic drums which forces everyone to play much louder... or at least did, since apparently in the recent 3-drum kit line-up this no longer was an issue. I guess technological breakthroughs in in-ear monitoring may have factored ? Or they simply hired much larger rehearsal spaces ?

Anyway, recommended reading.

[Trane]

The documentary on King Crimson https://www.progressiveears.org/foru...on+documentary will be broadcasted on Belgian public television tonight.

Thanks for the warning.

Can't help but thinking after seeing it that His Robness is somehow a bit of a twit and a twat.

And he's not afraid to demonstrate it to the absurd (this rockumentary).
I'd rather spend two hours with a fuming mad angry foul-mood Roger Waters than 5 minutes with a joyous Frippy.

I wonder if he's ever asked the audience members for permission to photograph them and use their picture like in this film..

[Dave (in MA)]

I don't know about anybody else, but when I see these Fripp essays with the center-justified titles and subtitles and letters to identify the sections, my eyes roll back in my head.

[NogbadTheBad]

I'm enjoying them

[Sturgeon's Lawyer]

I don't know about anybody else, but when I see these Fripp essays with the center-justified titles and subtitles and letters to identify the sections, my eyes roll back in my head.

Mine don't; I really enjoy those essays, and they have helped me find a piece of my place on this planet. (Not going to join Guitar Craft or anything, but they directed me towards something I didn't know I neneded.)

[taliesin]

I find anything RF writes to be of interest - some I agree with and some I don't, but he has thought deeply about his topics and is a worthwhile read.

[Batchman]

I find anything RF writes to be of interest - some I agree with and some I don't, but he has thought deeply about his topics and is a worthwhile read.

Back in the late 1970s I saw Fripp in one of his then-frequent solo performances at The Kitchen in NYC. He began the evening with a long soliloquy/disclaimer, starting with "I reserve the right to be unintelligent." and followed by numerous other rights-reservings.

[NogbadTheBad]

I saw him solo over a decade ago and he chatted with the audience all night. Clearly an odd duck but I am entertained.

[Trane]

I find anything RF writes to be of interest - some I agree with and some I don't, but he has thought deeply about his topics and is a worthwhile read.

I read his diary inside A Young Person's Guide to KC when it came out and thought his scribblings on the left page almost unreadable (still in the process of learning the language, though), but highly interested by the pictures on the right pages.

[interbellum]

Back in the late 1970s I saw Fripp in one of his then-frequent solo performances at The Kitchen in NYC. He began the evening with a long soliloquy/disclaimer, starting with "I reserve the right to be unintelligent." and followed by numerous other rights-reservings.

Although the picture in this thread from the Happy The Fan-forum was taken from a solo performance of Fripp in Washington DC I guess you were at a likewise show. In this pictures we see some members of Happy The Man! (I guess this was posted before.)

[Trane]

Can't remember if I posted this here or not

pote.jpg

It translates into an Equal opportunity for all walks of life campaign.

Yes, my buddy plays prog
To face intolerances, let's make a difference.
Q&A on www//:SexualOrientation.fr

[Trane]

Watching the Rockumentary a second time

I'd been startled the first time but hadn't reacted

At 23:45, Jakko talks about his opening day in the band and Fripp says of the original line-up containaing a bunch of cunts, chief of all ... (no name, because cut off)
But we see right after the cut the opening appearance of Michael Giles (and later Sinfield) and a video of Cat Food with brother Peter and Lake (and Keith). IMcD appears somewhat later on, so apparently he's not aimed at (especially that I find him in tears and apologizing about leaving the band a bit overdone).

Sooo, who is Fripp aiming at: Michael, Greg or Peter (S, not G)?
Taken litteraly about the first line-up, Sinfield should be disqualified since he was there until Earthbound, three years after the orignal line-up imploded or exploded I've always thought that Collins, Burrell Wallace and Sinfield as KC mk II).
Sh:ooting at Greg (RIP) is somewhat unfair (don't shoot the coffin, as it can't answer back), but I can't see Michael in the role of a "cunt"

[Halmyre]

Watching the Rockumentary a second time

I'd been startled the first time but hadn't reacted

At 23:45, Jakko talks about his opening day in the band and Fripp says of the original line-up containaing a bunch of cunts, chief of all ... (no name, because cut off)
But we see right after the cut the opening appearance of Michael Giles (and later Sinfield) and a video of Cat Food with brother Peter and Lake (and Keith). IMcD appears somewhat later on, so apparently he's not aimed at (especially that I find him in tears and apologizing about leaving the band a bit overdone).

Sooo, who is Fripp aiming at: Michael, Greg or Peter (S, not G)?
Taken litteraly about the first line-up, Sinfield should be disqualified since he was there until Earthbound, three years after the orignal line-up imploded or exploded I've always thought that Collins, Burrell Wallace and Sinfield as KC mk II).
Sh:ooting at Greg (RIP) is somewhat unfair (don't shoot the coffin, as it can't answer back), but I can't see Michael in the role of a "cunt"

Maybe Fripp referring to himself?

[calyx]

Watching the Rockumentary a second time

I'd been startled the first time but hadn't reacted

At 23:45, Jakko talks about his opening day in the band and Fripp says of the original line-up containaing a bunch of cunts, chief of all ... (no name, because cut off)
But we see right after the cut the opening appearance of Michael Giles (and later Sinfield) and a video of Cat Food with brother Peter and Lake (and Keith). IMcD appears somewhat later on, so apparently he's not aimed at (especially that I find him in tears and apologizing about leaving the band a bit overdone).

Sooo, who is Fripp aiming at: Michael, Greg or Peter (S, not G)?
Taken litteraly about the first line-up, Sinfield should be disqualified since he was there until Earthbound, three years after the orignal line-up imploded or exploded I've always thought that Collins, Burrell Wallace and Sinfield as KC mk II).
Sh:ooting at Greg (RIP) is somewhat unfair (don't shoot the coffin, as it can't answer back), but I can't see Michael in the role of a "cunt"

When I saw the doc, clearly Giles was the target and I thought the editing was inelegant and cheap in a "rock'n'roll documentary" way. I won't go into more details because that's their private lives but let's just say Jakko and his former father-in-law aren't exactly best buddies. I'm not even sure they've been in the same room since the Schizoid Band tour of Japan, which ended with Jakko saying he wouldn't continue unless there was a change of drummer.

[Trane]

Maybe Fripp referring to himself?

When I saw the doc, clearly Giles was the target and I thought the editing was inelegant and cheap in a "rock'n'roll documentary" way. I won't go into more details because that's their private lives but let's just say Jakko and his former father-in-law aren't exactly best buddies. I'm not even sure they've been in the same room since the Schizoid Band tour of Japan, which ended with Jakko saying he wouldn't continue unless there was a change of drummer.

Thx, I didn't know this
Apparently MG obliged and let the drum stool to Ian Wallace

Yessss, the production is inelegant to the max, because Jakko seems to imply this "ultimate cunt" title is Fripp's and not his.
Furthermore, IMcD's tearful appearance could now be blamed to him following MG out of the band, making Giles the real vilain.

My own guess about the "ultimate cunt according to Frippy" competition would've been in decreasing order would've been: Lake, Sinfield, Giles & McD.

[calyx]

Yessss, the production is inelegant to the max, because Jakko seems to imply this "ultimate cunt" title is Fripp's and not his.

Well, the implicit message of the editing is that both are in agreement. But it's a veiled message, intended for those in the know, which leaves the regular viewer quizzical at to what he's supposed to infer from the way Giles' entrance immediately follows the uttering of the insult.

Furthermore, IMcD's tearful appearance could now be blamed to him following MG out of the band, making Giles the real vilain.

I don't see what makes you say that. I've never read anything to the effect that McDonald and Giles' decision to leave was the result of one inciting the other to also leave. It seems to have been a simultaneous decision, albeit perhaps as a result of each telling the other how much they disliked life on the road and how much they missed their girlfriend/wife.

[battema]

Well, the implicit message of the editing is that both are in agreement. But it's a veiled message, intended for those in the know, which leaves the regular viewer quizzical at to what he's supposed to infer from the way Giles' entrance immediately follows the uttering of the insult.

Agreed...I thought it was a very funny edit and knew immediately who he was talking about (not that I'm some hardcore insider at all, just that I'd read enough bits along the way about some "abrasiveness" with regards to MG).

And IMHO Jakko's barb felt more like taking the piss, poking fun at Fripp as well as how fans perceive him from the outside as some vile cruel tyrant over the poor musicians within KC (since it seems that the final iterations of KC largely were very happy working together).

[Trane]

Well, the implicit message of the editing is that both are in agreement. But it's a veiled message, intended for those in the know, which leaves the regular viewer quizzical at to what he's supposed to infer from the way Giles' entrance immediately follows the uttering of the insult.

Well, Giles' entrance (literally and figuratively) would seem to confirm that he is a very abrasive man (as Battema says) right from his first spoken words.

I don't see what makes you say that. I've never read anything to the effect that McDonald and Giles' decision to leave was the result of one inciting the other to also leave. It seems to have been a simultaneous decision, albeit perhaps as a result of each telling the other how much they disliked life on the road and how much they missed their girlfriend/wife.

Well, it was most likely concerted at one point or another, especially given their common next project.
I never even thought of that eventuality, until seeing Ian tearfully apologizing for leaving the band.
I may read too much into Ian's regrets (which sound plausible), but Giles didn't go down that aisle (or it was left out).

Agreed...I thought it was a very funny edit and knew immediately who he was talking about (not that I'm some hardcore insider at all, just that I'd read enough bits along the way about some "abrasiveness" with regards to MG).

Well that whole MkI/II Crimson crowd's incestual musical meanderings over the next few decades would tend to dispel that abrasiveness.
If MG was so unpleasant, he wouldn't have been in the thick of things.
I mean, only Lake, Burrell (both too successful in later projects), Sinfield (ELP & PFM), McCullough and Haskell (the latter two never touring as a Crimson band) never frayed again with that crowd. MG even played with Tippett, if memory serves.

And IMHO Jakko's barb felt more like taking the piss, poking fun at Fripp as well as how fans perceive him from the outside as some vile cruel tyrant over the poor musicians within KC (since it seems that the final iterations of KC largely were very happy working together).

certainly my case, and this film only reinforces that.
Not sure the mutual happiness consensus about the latest incarnation of the film is the reality, but indeed some of the other ancient's interventions are certainly blunt an bash, though I suspect Broof is holding back a few pungent thoughts.


===================

BTW, there is a recent thread (created by Svettie's latest incarnation) in PA about Sinfield's importance in the first Crimson chapter - one that Frippy dismisses as "aerie-faerie" in the film.
Amusingly enough Sinfield implies that he might've been Frippy's daily poison in the band.

[Sturgeon's Lawyer]

Just listening for the first time to the 2021(?) reissue of Earthbound. The sound is better than I remember the vinyl being. That was like a really poor '70s bootleg. This is like a pretty good '70s bootleg.

[Mascodagama]

Well, the implicit message of the editing is that both are in agreement. But it's a veiled message, intended for those in the know, which leaves the regular viewer quizzical at to what he's supposed to infer from the way Giles' entrance immediately follows the uttering of the insult.

I'm just a regular viewer, but the implication that MG was the cunt-in-chief according to Fripp seemed pretty damn clear to me. I don't really know what else one could take from the edit.

Alternatively: in the Court of the Crimson Cunt, everyone is a cunt, and it takes one to know one.

[Batchman]

Just listening for the first time to the 2021(?) reissue of Earthbound. The sound is better than I remember the vinyl being. That was like a really poor '70s bootleg. This is like a pretty good '70s bootleg.

The sound quality might be better but the musical content is still fair to poor IMHO.

[calyx]

I'm just a regular viewer, but the implication that MG was the cunt-in-chief according to Fripp seemed pretty damn clear to me. I don't really know what else one could take from the edit.

Agreed but I saw no one commenting on this when the film came out so I thought it might not have been that obvious to some.

[unclemeat]

The most revealing detail in this documentary is Ian McDonald's hunted look.